Mina, concerning your three questions in red above, the answers are completely fallacious and based on personal opinions of either you, or people who taught you. I need a computer to comment so I'll do that later, but don't let it slip your mind. Oujai
There is no way the Copts would pronounce Greek as the Greeks. Why? There is a a simple rule in languages. The language that is borrowed would be pronounced as the language it is replacing. I will give you some examples:
Arabic when is pronounced by the Copts is different than the way it is supposed to be pronounced. Take the "th" for example ans it turned to "T". and the "Kaf" turned to a stop, the "zal" is confused with the "zane" ans so on.
English is pronounced differently by the Indians than the English. The w and v are exchanged.
German when pronounced by the English speakers, it loses the "gh", "kh" and so on.
So, when the Copts borrowed Greek words they pronounce it according to the Coptic toungue not according to the Greek tongue. That is natural. For example, all the English, Italian and French words borrowed by the Egyptians are said according to the Egyptian tongue and not according to the British or the American. Take the word "next" is said "neck-est", "people" is said "beeb'ole", "this" is said "zis", "thin" is said "sin" and so on.
Also, the Greek alphabet had different sounds when they were borrowed than they are nowadays.
To sum up, the movement to say the Greek words as the Greeks is against the natural development of languages and thus unsuccessful. We still say eso-wab snd se-otokos and se-os, keryalayson.
You forget one of my favorites: "wur-led" for world.
Not that I am taking sides, or want to for that matter. It would be pointless.
I would like to throw a little mirkiness in the argument presented.
What would one label or say relative to a Saudi Arabian dialect as it apertains to proper/classical Arabic? The Saudis are the ultimate Arab in Arabic. How would one qualify that situation being that they are the 'keepers of the faith' and other things?
The Saudi dialect is kind of bizarre to listen to in conversation. Does the fact that Egyptians constitute the most populous of the Arabic speaking dictate their imposition of rules on pronunciation?
Just some thoughts from the cyberzone.
There are borrowed words that maintain their full original pronunciation from their original tongues. Hors d'oeuvre anyone? Or should I say: 'horse dovers' anyone?
[quote author=imikhail link=topic=11113.msg134665#msg134665 date=1301484117] To sum up, the movement to say the Greek words as the Greeks is against the natural development of languages and thus unsuccessful. We still say eso-wab snd se-otokos and se-os, keryalayson.
even thoo that goes pronunciation of theta to be "thita" is against the proposed OB dialect?!
[quote author=ilovesaintmark link=topic=11113.msg134666#msg134666 date=1301485393] Does the fact that Egyptians constitute the most populous of the Arabic speaking dictate their imposition of rules on pronunciation?
OF COURSE!!!! do you know how hard is it to type up a personal latter in egy arabic?! HARD!
"To sum up, the movement to say the Greek words as the Greeks is against the natural development of languages and thus unsuccessful. We still say eso-wab snd se-otokos and se-os, keryalayson." even thoo that goes pronunciation of theta to be "thita" is against the proposed OB dialect?!
"Does the fact that Egyptians constitute the most populous of the Arabic speaking dictate their imposition of rules on pronunciation?" OF COURSE!!!! do you know how hard is it to type up a personal latter in egy arabic?! HARD!
"Mina, concerning your three questions in red above, the answers are completely fallacious and based on personal opinions of either you, or people who taught you. I need a computer to comment so I'll do that later, but don't let it slip your mind. Oujai" hehe...i wasn't asking a question...i was quoting imikhail. since every quote i write is spammed, i started putting my quotes in red.
Even thoo that goes pronunciation of theta to be "thita" is against the proposed OB dialect?!
I am not sure what you are trying to say? Copts do not know how to pronounce the "th" as in thin. OB does not have "th". So, it is irrelevent, in OB, the letter thita because it is "tetta" it is always a "T".
"Does the fact that Egyptians constitute the most populous of the Arabic speaking dictate their imposition of rules on pronunciation?"
Of course not. In Egypt, there is a difference between spoken Arabic and formal Arabic where the letters are said different. In spoken Arabic there is no difference between "Zane" and "dza" and "thal". Also, the "thal" is converted to "d" and the "th" is converted to "t". This does not happen if you are reading formally.
Saudi Arabians do not have this mix and the Egyptian colliqual does not constitute rules of pronunciation. That would have made Al Azhar to go bezerk.
Mina, ok, before getting on to the red comments earlier, I wish to point this out to you: the "s" replacing "th" in Arabic is not actually a Coptic characteristic, but a French characteristic that passed into the colloquial Arabic due to the French occupation in late eighteenth century and early nineteenth century and afterwards. Hence "saotokos" and "masalan" and "saneyan", "salesan", etc. Please note those words were not so common in Arabic before the nineteenth century, but the other widespread words in Arabic were pronounced like this in Egyptian Arabic e.g. "etnein", "talata", "ta'lab", "medallem", "dalma", "toum", "te'ban", "tanya (crease)", and "tamanya". You said "it is taught that the word "eu,y" is purely greek....so the the letter is a she." for example, we call the hymn Evshes for "Eu,ec" and not evkes. also other greek words like metanoia which we say metaneia and not metanoia. and the many old books that kept kai instead of ke" In fact, Mr. Erian Guirguis in his book comments on the Egyptians (as though he wasn't one) and says "the Egyptians pronounce the word prayer as /owka/ but clearly that is not the correct way". The guy is making fun of how the word is actually pronounced. Anyway, I suppose it may have been also pronouced as /ewsheya/ with the plural /awashy/ as you can clearly see the Egyptian tongue cannot pronounce the 'v', but still he likes to teach his subordinates that it is pronounced /evshi:s/ = /evshees/!!!! Very strange. In fact, in support to what imikhail says in his last post, you notice the Egyptians say /barawa/ for the Italian 'bravo' - what does that tell you?
You said: "first, lets look at the sh and ch. the letter is always taught to "ch"....we say ti-echerombi ethnesos or etitshocee (which should et-chocee). "`P[oic" should be Ep-chois "`e`P[oic" or "`m`P[oic" should be e-ep-chois or em-ep-shois....but not much people say that. they mixed it all together and say e-pet-shois or a e-mep-shois. they remove the jinkum on the pi and mix it with the actual word "chois"....it's a movement towards GB. that e at the end is not part of the word but it is added much in hymns to conduct harmony in a lahn. like hos erof ari-ho-oo chasfe (should be chasf)." This is not about the deficit in Arabic language actually. The letter /shima/ was used to be pronounced as you rightly point out /ch/. Then in Sa'idic it was /dj/. Both those diphthongs laxed over the years, and became /sh/ and /j/ as in the French 'j' respectively. So even /chromba/, or /chasaf/ are wrong, or rather not the natural evolution of how we received the language, and so is /chois/. Now, fallaciously you owe the 'e' after /shasaf/ and /ebshois/ to harmony in hymns. The fact of the matter is that the vowels in hieroglyphics, hieratic and consequently demotic, and later Coptic, were often not written but pronounced. OK, but I am not talking about vowels now, am I? No, but what happens is that there are subtle connections between words with vowel-like conjunctions. That is why you see the Egyptian people struggling to pronounce English the way the native speakers do. They usually insert a subtle pause between words, so "first step" becomes /first e step/. Exactly, that is it. That is most probably the origin of the emergence of jinkims in the latter ages (can't remember when exactly), but even the jinkim is used differently in Sa'idic as opposed to Bohairic Coptic. Bottom line is people who sing arebsalen according to HCOC do it improperly: Coptic is becoming more and more Anglicised, not even Hellenised!!!! God bless us all and have mercy on His Church, and its treasures including the language our forefathers used to speak in. Oujai
Sorry forgot to comment on this "epetshois" as GB enthusiasts like to pronounce is not because the jinkim was shifted but because the letter shima (according to them) is pronouced /ech/, not just /ch/, because it is ETCHima. Funny? Or maybe not? Oujai
Seriously, if any of you have a chance to read Fr. Shenouda Maher's thesis, do it. It is very interesting and has scientific evidence that go back to the hieroglyphic inscriptions in support of the way Coptic used to sound before Aryain's intervention.
The Spring is here, the birds are nestled in the trees, and the sun is out. How can I feel cold? The zeal of the Spirit of God burns within my heart, and the Hope of His Mercy is in my spirit...from whence can I feel breadth of coldness?
I yearn for the warmth of His Heart and my heart beats for the sake of hearing His Voice.
He is our Sun, and there is no need for any other light in our lives. He is at the center of the Heavenly Jerusalem, and there is no need to look for anything except Him.
No, my friend, I'm just getting warmed and basking in His Glow.
[quote author=ilovesaintmark link=topic=11113.msg134753#msg134753 date=1301533726] O Mina, Mina, Mina, where is your poetic interpretation?
LOL
Mina, just a note about what you stated regarding the Greek word "Evkee" earlier...the first thing they taught us in Greek class was the Alphabet and its pronunciations...for the letter "X," it's described as being pronounced like a "c" as in "cat" or a "ch" as in "chameleon," an aspirated hard "c" sound. In my studies of Greek, I have not found any cases in which the "X" is pronounced as "sh." Just wanted to point that out.
[quote author=GODlovesme link=topic=11113.msg134794#msg134794 date=1301551093] Mina, just a note about what you stated regarding the Greek word "Evkee" earlier...the first thing they taught us in Greek class was the Alphabet and its pronunciations...for the letter "X," it's described as being pronounced like a "c" as in "cat" or a "ch" as in "chameleon," an aspirated hard "c" sound. In my studies of Greek, I have not found any cases in which the "X" is pronounced as "sh." Just wanted to point that out.
it's probably the "chi" sound that we are referring to.
[quote author=minatasgeel link=topic=11113.msg134797#msg134797 date=1301552058] [quote author=GODlovesme link=topic=11113.msg134794#msg134794 date=1301551093] Mina, just a note about what you stated regarding the Greek word "Evkee" earlier...the first thing they taught us in Greek class was the Alphabet and its pronunciations...for the letter "X," it's described as being pronounced like a "c" as in "cat" or a "ch" as in "chameleon," an aspirated hard "c" sound. In my studies of Greek, I have not found any cases in which the "X" is pronounced as "sh." Just wanted to point that out.
it's probably the "chi" sound that we are referring to.
Yeah...the "ch" sound resembles the "kh" sound in Arabic (but lighter)...it's between a hard "c" and "kh."
DEar ilovesaintmark, I'm impressed by your poetic aptitude. However I was referring to myself steering with a bit of cold since you told me: bless you... hehe Oujai
[quote author=GODlovesme link=topic=11113.msg134794#msg134794 date=1301551093] the first thing they taught us in Greek class was the Alphabet and its pronunciations...for the letter "X," it's described as being pronounced like a "c" as in "cat" or a "ch" as in "chameleon," an aspirated hard "c" sound. In my studies of Greek, I have not found any cases in which the "X" is pronounced as "sh." Just wanted to point that out.
Out of curiosity, how do Greeks pronounce ,eire? Is it "khere"? I suspect it is. When the saluation was borrowed into Greek, it became ,ere. And I am nearly 100% sure that no OB supporter or Fr Shenouda's congregation pronounces the word as "Khaire" as OB rules say it should be.
Again don't get me wrong. GB is not innocent of inconsistency of pronunciation rules. But I'm curious how OB supports say ,ere ne Maria.
In Classical Greek, the greeting is "Khairete!" which literally means "be glad" or "rejoice." It's pronounced as a "kh" sound, not as "sh." I believe this is the 2nd person plural present imperative active conjugation of the verb "Khairo." So it can be used as the verb or it is also used as a greeting to say "Hi" and "Bye." I don't really know much about the differences between GB and OB, but this is what I know about this particular word.
Ophadece, you're right. I need to learn Arabic to read Erian' Moftah's book. See my comments below.
[quote author=ophadece link=topic=11113.msg134698#msg134698 date=1301505139] In fact, Mr. Erian Guirguis in his book comments on the Egyptians (as though he wasn't one) and says "the Egyptians pronounce the word prayer as /owka/ but clearly that is not the correct way". The guy is making fun of how the word is actually pronounced. Anyway, I suppose it may have been also pronouced as /ewsheya/ with the plural /awashy/ as you can clearly see the Egyptian tongue cannot pronounce the 'v', but still he likes to teach his subordinates that it is pronounced /evshi:s/ = /evshees/!!!! Very strange. I agree with you that he was sarcastically criticizing OB. It probably was not /owka/. And I agree that it probably was /owsha/. In fact there is a urban legend that says when the Muslims protested against the Copts praying very loudly in the Church of Abu Serga in Old Cairo, they coined the phrase "Batalo al dawsh" or "Stop the dawsaha". In OB, "dawsha" is the pronunciation of ]eu,y, which means prayer. So "dawasha" which in colloquial Arabic means noise, is actually etymologically Coptic for prayer. The point of the story is that "dawasha" corroborates the fact that the word eu,y was never /evki/ nor /evshe/. It was always /owsha/, which contradicts both OB and GB's current pronunciation rules.
This is not about the deficit in Arabic language actually. The letter /shima/ was used to be pronounced as you rightly point out /ch/. Then in Sa'idic it was /dj/. Both those diphthongs laxed over the years, and became /sh/ and /j/ as in the French 'j' respectively.
I agree with your statement, with the exception that Sahidic /dj/ was first. Sahidic use and pronunciation was always before Bohairic.
I'll comment on the rest of this post later. George
[quote author=GODlovesme link=topic=11113.msg135058#msg135058 date=1301795269] In Classical Greek, the greeting is "Khairete!" which literally means "be glad" or "rejoice." It's pronounced as a "kh" sound, not as "sh." I believe this is the 2nd person plural present imperative active conjugation of the verb "Khairo." So it can be used as the verb or it is also used as a greeting to say "Hi" and "Bye." I don't really know much about the differences between GB and OB, but this is what I know about this particular word.
Godlovesme, what about the 2nd person singular conjugation? How is it pronounced? Shouldn't it be "khairein"? Or is "khairein" the imperative form? This maybe an Alexandrian Greek idiologism. Take a look at page 160 of this book This is how people greeted one another. It's also a known fact that Sahidic Coptic converted the Greek suffix "-ein" into "e" so ,airein was borrowed and became ,ere.
The question is how was it pronounced? Most likely, /shere/ which doesn't follow OB or GB reconstruction.
As far as I know of verbs in Greek, anything that ends with the suffix "-ein" is the present infinitive of that verb. And it is still pronounced "kh." "Khaire" is the singular. "Khaire" and "Khairete" are both used as greetings.
Comments
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Oujai
There is no way the Copts would pronounce Greek as the Greeks. Why? There is a a simple rule in languages. The language that is borrowed would be pronounced as the language it is replacing. I will give you some examples:
Arabic when is pronounced by the Copts is different than the way it is supposed to be pronounced. Take the "th" for example ans it turned to "T". and the "Kaf" turned to a stop, the "zal" is confused with the "zane" ans so on.
English is pronounced differently by the Indians than the English. The w and v are exchanged.
German when pronounced by the English speakers, it loses the "gh", "kh" and so on.
So, when the Copts borrowed Greek words they pronounce it according to the Coptic toungue not according to the Greek tongue. That is natural. For example, all the English, Italian and French words borrowed by the Egyptians are said according to the Egyptian tongue and not according to the British or the American. Take the word "next" is said "neck-est", "people" is said "beeb'ole", "this" is said "zis", "thin" is said "sin" and so on.
Also, the Greek alphabet had different sounds when they were borrowed than they are nowadays.
To sum up, the movement to say the Greek words as the Greeks is against the natural development of languages and thus unsuccessful. We still say eso-wab snd se-otokos and se-os, keryalayson.
Thanks
You forget one of my favorites: "wur-led" for world.
Not that I am taking sides, or want to for that matter. It would be pointless.
I would like to throw a little mirkiness in the argument presented.
What would one label or say relative to a Saudi Arabian dialect as it apertains to proper/classical Arabic?
The Saudis are the ultimate Arab in Arabic. How would one qualify that situation being that they are the 'keepers
of the faith' and other things?
The Saudi dialect is kind of bizarre to listen to in conversation.
Does the fact that Egyptians constitute the most populous of the Arabic speaking dictate their imposition of rules on pronunciation?
Just some thoughts from the cyberzone.
There are borrowed words that maintain their full original pronunciation from their original tongues. Hors d'oeuvre anyone? Or should I say: 'horse dovers' anyone?
To sum up, the movement to say the Greek words as the Greeks is against the natural development of languages and thus unsuccessful. We still say eso-wab snd se-otokos and se-os, keryalayson.
even thoo that goes pronunciation of theta to be "thita" is against the proposed OB dialect?!
[quote author=ilovesaintmark link=topic=11113.msg134666#msg134666 date=1301485393]
Does the fact that Egyptians constitute the most populous of the Arabic speaking dictate their imposition of rules on pronunciation?
OF COURSE!!!! do you know how hard is it to type up a personal latter in egy arabic?! HARD!
even thoo that goes pronunciation of theta to be "thita" is against the proposed OB dialect?!
"Does the fact that Egyptians constitute the most populous of the Arabic speaking dictate their imposition of rules on pronunciation?"
OF COURSE!!!! do you know how hard is it to type up a personal latter in egy arabic?! HARD!
"Mina, concerning your three questions in red above, the answers are completely fallacious and based on personal opinions of either you, or people who taught you. I need a computer to comment so I'll do that later, but don't let it slip your mind. Oujai"
hehe...i wasn't asking a question...i was quoting imikhail. since every quote i write is spammed, i started putting my quotes in red.
Even thoo that goes pronunciation of theta to be "thita" is against the proposed OB dialect?!
I am not sure what you are trying to say? Copts do not know how to pronounce the "th" as in thin. OB does not have "th". So, it is irrelevent, in OB, the letter thita because it is "tetta" it is always a "T".
Of course not. In Egypt, there is a difference between spoken Arabic and formal Arabic where the letters are said different. In spoken Arabic there is no difference between "Zane" and "dza" and "thal". Also, the "thal" is converted to "d" and the "th" is converted to "t". This does not happen if you are reading formally.
Saudi Arabians do not have this mix and the Egyptian colliqual does not constitute rules of pronunciation. That would have made Al Azhar to go bezerk.
You said "it is taught that the word "eu,y" is purely greek....so the the letter is a she."
for example, we call the hymn Evshes for "Eu,ec" and not evkes. also other greek words like metanoia which we say metaneia and not metanoia. and the many old books that kept kai instead of ke"
In fact, Mr. Erian Guirguis in his book comments on the Egyptians (as though he wasn't one) and says "the Egyptians pronounce the word prayer as /owka/ but clearly that is not the correct way". The guy is making fun of how the word is actually pronounced. Anyway, I suppose it may have been also pronouced as /ewsheya/ with the plural /awashy/ as you can clearly see the Egyptian tongue cannot pronounce the 'v', but still he likes to teach his subordinates that it is pronounced /evshi:s/ = /evshees/!!!! Very strange. In fact, in support to what imikhail says in his last post, you notice the Egyptians say /barawa/ for the Italian 'bravo' - what does that tell you?
You said: "first, lets look at the sh and ch. the letter is always taught to "ch"....we say ti-echerombi ethnesos or etitshocee (which should et-chocee).
"`P[oic" should be Ep-chois
"`e`P[oic" or "`m`P[oic" should be e-ep-chois or em-ep-shois....but not much people say that. they mixed it all together and say e-pet-shois or a e-mep-shois. they remove the jinkum on the pi and mix it with the actual word "chois"....it's a movement towards GB.
that e at the end is not part of the word but it is added much in hymns to conduct harmony in a lahn. like hos erof ari-ho-oo chasfe (should be chasf)."
This is not about the deficit in Arabic language actually. The letter /shima/ was used to be pronounced as you rightly point out /ch/. Then in Sa'idic it was /dj/. Both those diphthongs laxed over the years, and became /sh/ and /j/ as in the French 'j' respectively. So even /chromba/, or /chasaf/ are wrong, or rather not the natural evolution of how we received the language, and so is /chois/. Now, fallaciously you owe the 'e' after /shasaf/ and /ebshois/ to harmony in hymns. The fact of the matter is that the vowels in hieroglyphics, hieratic and consequently demotic, and later Coptic, were often not written but pronounced. OK, but I am not talking about vowels now, am I? No, but what happens is that there are subtle connections between words with vowel-like conjunctions. That is why you see the Egyptian people struggling to pronounce English the way the native speakers do. They usually insert a subtle pause between words, so "first step" becomes /first e step/. Exactly, that is it. That is most probably the origin of the emergence of jinkims in the latter ages (can't remember when exactly), but even the jinkim is used differently in Sa'idic as opposed to Bohairic Coptic. Bottom line is people who sing arebsalen according to HCOC do it improperly: Coptic is becoming more and more Anglicised, not even Hellenised!!!!
God bless us all and have mercy on His Church, and its treasures including the language our forefathers used to speak in.
Oujai
Oujai
"etchima" (sneeze).
Response: God Bless you.
[joke]
Seriously, if any of you have a chance to read Fr. Shenouda Maher's thesis, do it. It is very interesting and has scientific evidence that go back to the hieroglyphic inscriptions in support of the way Coptic used to sound before Aryain's intervention.
Thanks
Oujai
The Spring is here, the birds are nestled in the trees, and the sun is out. How can I feel cold?
The zeal of the Spirit of God burns within my heart, and the Hope of His Mercy is in my spirit...from whence can I feel
breadth of coldness?
I yearn for the warmth of His Heart and my heart beats for the sake of hearing His Voice.
He is our Sun, and there is no need for any other light in our lives. He is at the center of the Heavenly Jerusalem, and there is no need to look for anything except Him.
No, my friend, I'm just getting warmed and basking in His Glow.
last week, 3 days after spring started.....guess what happens....rain and HAIL!!! hail people....i havn't seen hail since my sophomore year in HS.
and just today they announce a "weather advisory" til friday in the new brunswick and piscataway area.
O Mina, Mina, Mina, where is your poetic interpretation?
LOL
Mina, just a note about what you stated regarding the Greek word "Evkee" earlier...the first thing they taught us in Greek class was the Alphabet and its pronunciations...for the letter "X," it's described as being pronounced like a "c" as in "cat" or a "ch" as in "chameleon," an aspirated hard "c" sound. In my studies of Greek, I have not found any cases in which the "X" is pronounced as "sh." Just wanted to point that out.
Mina, just a note about what you stated regarding the Greek word "Evkee" earlier...the first thing they taught us in Greek class was the Alphabet and its pronunciations...for the letter "X," it's described as being pronounced like a "c" as in "cat" or a "ch" as in "chameleon," an aspirated hard "c" sound. In my studies of Greek, I have not found any cases in which the "X" is pronounced as "sh." Just wanted to point that out.
it's probably the "chi" sound that we are referring to.
[quote author=GODlovesme link=topic=11113.msg134794#msg134794 date=1301551093]
Mina, just a note about what you stated regarding the Greek word "Evkee" earlier...the first thing they taught us in Greek class was the Alphabet and its pronunciations...for the letter "X," it's described as being pronounced like a "c" as in "cat" or a "ch" as in "chameleon," an aspirated hard "c" sound. In my studies of Greek, I have not found any cases in which the "X" is pronounced as "sh." Just wanted to point that out.
it's probably the "chi" sound that we are referring to.
Yeah...the "ch" sound resembles the "kh" sound in Arabic (but lighter)...it's between a hard "c" and "kh."
Oujai
the first thing they taught us in Greek class was the Alphabet and its pronunciations...for the letter "X," it's described as being pronounced like a "c" as in "cat" or a "ch" as in "chameleon," an aspirated hard "c" sound. In my studies of Greek, I have not found any cases in which the "X" is pronounced as "sh." Just wanted to point that out.
Out of curiosity, how do Greeks pronounce ,eire? Is it "khere"? I suspect it is. When the saluation was borrowed into Greek, it became ,ere. And I am nearly 100% sure that no OB supporter or Fr Shenouda's congregation pronounces the word as "Khaire" as OB rules say it should be.
Again don't get me wrong. GB is not innocent of inconsistency of pronunciation rules. But I'm curious how OB supports say ,ere ne Maria.
[quote author=ophadece link=topic=11113.msg134698#msg134698 date=1301505139]
In fact, Mr. Erian Guirguis in his book comments on the Egyptians (as though he wasn't one) and says "the Egyptians pronounce the word prayer as /owka/ but clearly that is not the correct way". The guy is making fun of how the word is actually pronounced. Anyway, I suppose it may have been also pronouced as /ewsheya/ with the plural /awashy/ as you can clearly see the Egyptian tongue cannot pronounce the 'v', but still he likes to teach his subordinates that it is pronounced /evshi:s/ = /evshees/!!!! Very strange.
I agree with you that he was sarcastically criticizing OB. It probably was not /owka/. And I agree that it probably was /owsha/. In fact there is a urban legend that says when the Muslims protested against the Copts praying very loudly in the Church of Abu Serga in Old Cairo, they coined the phrase "Batalo al dawsh" or "Stop the dawsaha". In OB, "dawsha" is the pronunciation of ]eu,y, which means prayer. So "dawasha" which in colloquial Arabic means noise, is actually etymologically Coptic for prayer. The point of the story is that "dawasha" corroborates the fact that the word eu,y was never /evki/ nor /evshe/. It was always /owsha/, which contradicts both OB and GB's current pronunciation rules.
I agree with your statement, with the exception that Sahidic /dj/ was first. Sahidic use and pronunciation was always before Bohairic.
I'll comment on the rest of this post later.
George
In Classical Greek, the greeting is "Khairete!" which literally means "be glad" or "rejoice." It's pronounced as a "kh" sound, not as "sh." I believe this is the 2nd person plural present imperative active conjugation of the verb "Khairo." So it can be used as the verb or it is also used as a greeting to say "Hi" and "Bye." I don't really know much about the differences between GB and OB, but this is what I know about this particular word.
Godlovesme, what about the 2nd person singular conjugation? How is it pronounced? Shouldn't it be "khairein"? Or is "khairein" the imperative form? This maybe an Alexandrian Greek idiologism. Take a look at page 160 of this book This is how people greeted one another. It's also a known fact that Sahidic Coptic converted the Greek suffix "-ein" into "e" so ,airein was borrowed and became ,ere.
The question is how was it pronounced? Most likely, /shere/ which doesn't follow OB or GB reconstruction.