Scope of Salvation

JustinWilliams

Dear friends,

What is the official stance of the Coptic Orthodox Church concerning the scope of salvation?  By that I would like to know if the church believes that salvation is found only through belief in Christ and the Gospel or whether the church holds that there will be some who will inherit eternal life who did not believe or know of Christ before the Judgment.

Thanks,

Justin  :)

minatasgeel

[quote author=JustinWilliams link=topic=7888.msg102365#msg102365 date=1240946053]
Dear friends,

What is the official stance of the Coptic Orthodox Church concerning the scope of salvation?  By that I would like to know if the church believes that salvation is found only through belief in Christ and the Gospel or whether the church holds that there will be some who will inherit eternal life who did not believe or know of Christ before the Judgment.

Thanks,

Justin  :)


Wow.....you are going straight for the most famous question people ask when even hearing about our Church. I'll let others reply with full answers that are taking from the holy Bible. After all, we just follow Him and what He gave us to meet Him again.

Theophilus 1

I think the following verses from Romans and James touch on this topic. Hopefully Fr. Peter or others with better understanding of our churches interpretation will explain more.

"For God does not show favoritism. When the Gentiles sin, they will be destroyed, even though they never had God’s written law. And the Jews, who do have God’s law, will be judged by that law when they fail to obey it. For merely listening to the law doesn’t make us right with God. It is obeying the law that makes us right in his sight. Even Gentiles, who do not have God’s written law, show that they know his law when they instinctively obey it, even without having heard it. They demonstrate that God’s law is written in their hearts, for their own conscience and thoughts either accuse them or tell them they are doing right.  And this is the message I proclaim—that the day is coming when God, through Christ Jesus, will judge everyone’s secret life." Romans 2:11-16

"Remember, it is sin to know what you ought to do and then not do it." James 4:17

In Christ
Theophilus

JustinWilliams

[quote author=minagir link=topic=7888.msg102372#msg102372 date=1240957022]
[quote author=JustinWilliams link=topic=7888.msg102365#msg102365 date=1240946053]
Dear friends,

What is the official stance of the Coptic Orthodox Church concerning the scope of salvation?  By that I would like to know if the church believes that salvation is found only through belief in Christ and the Gospel or whether the church holds that there will be some who will inherit eternal life who did not believe or know of Christ before the Judgment.

Thanks,

Justin  :)


Wow.....you are going straight for the most famous question people ask when even hearing about our Church. I'll let others reply with full answers that are taking from the holy Bible. After all, we just follow Him and what He gave us to meet Him again.


Minagir,

Thank you for taking the time to respond to my post.  I only ask this question because I would like to know the Coptic Orthodox Church's doctrine concerning the topic and the reason for that viewpoint.

This question is very much intertwined with the question of who Jesus Christ is and what was his purpose.

Thanks!

Justin :)

JustinWilliams

[quote author=Theophilus 1 link=topic=7888.msg102375#msg102375 date=1240959830]
I think the following verses from Romans and James touch on this topic. Hopefully Fr. Peter or others with better understanding of our churches interpretation will explain more.

"For God does not show favoritism. When the Gentiles sin, they will be destroyed, even though they never had God’s written law. And the Jews, who do have God’s law, will be judged by that law when they fail to obey it. For merely listening to the law doesn’t make us right with God. It is obeying the law that makes us right in his sight. Even Gentiles, who do not have God’s written law, show that they know his law when they instinctively obey it, even without having heard it. They demonstrate that God’s law is written in their hearts, for their own conscience and thoughts either accuse them or tell them they are doing right.  And this is the message I proclaim—that the day is coming when God, through Christ Jesus, will judge everyone’s secret life." Romans 2:11-16

"Remember, it is sin to know what you ought to do and then not do it." James 4:17

In Christ
Theophilus



Theophilus,

Thank you for taking the time to respond to my post.  ;D

My understanding of the the Romans 2 passage is that St. Paul is giving reason for why God is just in judging all men, for all men have been made aware of God's law either through the Law (Israel) or the conscience (Gentiles).  However, apart from the salvific work of Christ, the law only condemns and due to our sinful nature we, alone, are not able to fulfill the Law.  Christ, on the other hand, has fulfilled the Law and his death provides salvation from our iniquities (or unfaithfulness to the Law) and provides empowerment (through the Holy Spirit) to begin the process of becoming more Christ-like as we strive in the faith and obey the Law with His aid.

The passage of James 4, according to my understanding, is a call to believing brethren to only seek to obey what has been revealed by God.  They are not to suppose to dwell on what they will do tomorrow or the day after, but only to seek to be obedient to God's will that day for that is all that they can know.  And God's will, as revealed through Scripture, is to believe in His Son as the Savior and Redeemer that was promised from the Garden of Eden.

James also said, "For whoever keeps the whole law but fails in one point has become accountable for all of it (James 2:10)".  And Moses said, "Cursed be anyone who does not confirm the words of this law by doing them (Deuteronomy 27:26)".  Jesus Christ came to redeem us from that curse.

Christ did say:

St. John 14:6-7 (ESV)
"Jesus said to them, ' I am the way, and the truth, and the life.  No one comes to the Father except through me.  If you had known me, you would have known my Father also.  From now on you do know him and have seen him."

St. John 10:1-10 (ESV)
"Truly, truly, I say to you, he who does not enter the sheepfold by the door but climbs in by another way, that man is a thief and a robber. But he who enters by the door is the shepherd of the sheep. To him the gatekeeper opens. The sheep hear his voice, and he calls his own sheep by name and leads them out. When he has brought out all his own, he goes before them, and the sheep follow him, for they know his voice. A stranger they will not follow, but they will flee from him, for they do not know the voice of strangers.” This figure of speech Jesus used with them, but they did not understand what he was saying to them. So Jesus again said to them, “Truly, truly, I say to you, I am the door of the sheep. All who came before me are thieves and robbers, but the sheep did not listen to them. I am the door. If anyone enters by me, he will be saved and will go in and out and find pasture. The thief comes only to steal and kill and destroy. I came that they may have life and have it abundantly."

As a Christian I am called to be like the Berean brethren in Acts, who searched the Scriptures diligently to confirm the teachings of the Apostle Paul.  I appreciate all answers and I look forward to understanding more about my brothers and sisters in the faith who belong to the Coptic Orthodox Church.


Blessings,

Justin

JustinWilliams

Also, please bear with my ignorance of the doctrines of the Coptic Orthodox Church.  Tonight I am beginning to read the book Introduction to the Coptic Orthodox Church by Fr. Tadros Y. Malaty.