In the Agpeya, we quote the psalms in the latanies of the Compline Prayer and we say,
"... among the dead, no one can remember, nor do those in Hades offer thanks..."
I am perplexed by this saying. I thought that the dead CAN remember, as illustrated by the Rich Man Vs. Lazarus. Christ said that the rich ased Abraham to send Lazarus to witness to his brothers on Earth. He remembered his brothers and cared for them and had thoughts about them even while in Hades.
How is it then that "among the dead, no one can remember"?
Comments
Not a memory of events, but a memory of praise to God.
RO
Conference 1 Chapter 14:
Of the continuance of the soul.
Wherefore every one while still existing in this body should already be aware that he must be committed to that state and office, of which he made himself a sharer and an adherent while in this life, nor should he doubt that in that eternal world he will be partner of him, whose servant and minister he chose to make himself here: according to that saying of our Lord which says If any man serve Me, let him follow Me, and where I am, there shall My servant also be. John 12:26 For as the kingdom of the devil is gained by consenting to sin, so the kingdom of God is attained by the practice of virtue in purity of heart and spiritual knowledge. But where the kingdom of God is, there most certainly eternal life is enjoyed, and where the kingdom of the devil is, there without doubt is death and the grave. And the man who is in this condition, cannot praise the Lord, according to the saying of the prophet which tells us: The dead cannot praise You, O Lord; neither all they that go down into the grave (doubtless of sin). But we, says he, who live (not forsooth to sin nor to this world but to God) will bless the Lord, from this time forth for evermore: for in death no man remembers God: but in the grave (of sin) who will confess to the Lord? i.e., no one will. For no man even though he were to call himself a Christian a thousand times over, or a monk, confesses God when he is sinning: no man who allows those things which the Lord hates, remembers God, nor calls himself with any truth the servant of Him, whose commands he scorns with obstinate rashness: in which death the blessed Apostle declares that the widow is involved, who gives herself to pleasure, saying a widow who gives herself to pleasure is dead while she lives. 1 Timothy 5:6 There are then many who while still living in this body are dead, and lying in the grave cannot praise God; and on the contrary there are many who though they are dead in the body yet bless God in the spirit, and praise Him, according to this: O you spirits and souls of the righteous, bless the Lord: and every spirit shall praise the Lord. And in the Apocalypse the souls of them that are slain are not only said to praise God but to address Him also. Revelation 6:9-10 In the gospel too the Lord says with still greater clearness to the Sadducees: Have you not read that which was spoken by God, when He said to you: I am the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac and the God of Jacob. He is not the God of the dead but of the living: for all do live unto Him. Matthew 22:31-32 Of whom also the Apostle says: wherefore God is not ashamed to be called their God: for He has prepared for them a city. Hebrews 11:16 For that they are not idle after the separation from this body, and are not incapable of feeling, the parable in the gospel shows, which tells us of the beggar Lazarus and Dives clothed in purple, one of whom obtained a position of bliss, i.e., Abraham's bosom, the other is consumed with the dreadful heat of eternal fire. But if you care too to understand the words spoken to the thief Today you shall be with Me in Paradise, Luke 23:43 what do they clearly show but that not only does their former intelligence continue with the souls, but also that in their changed condition they partake of some state which corresponds to their actions and deserts? For the Lord would certainly never have promised him this, if He had known that his soul after being separated from the flesh would either have been deprived of perception or have been resolved into nothing. For it was not his flesh but his soul which was to enter Paradise with Christ. At least we must avoid, and shun with the utmost horror, that wicked punctuation of the heretics, who, as they do not believe that Christ could be found in Paradise on the same day on which He descended into hell, thus punctuate Verily, I say unto you today, and making a stop apply you shall be with Me in Paradise, in such a way that they imagine that this promise was not fulfilled at once after he departed from this life, but that it will be fulfilled after the resurrection, as they do not understand what before the time of His resurrection He declared to the Jews, who fancied that He was hampered by human difficulties and weakness of the flesh as they were: No man has ascended into heaven, but He who came down from heaven, even the Son of man who is in heaven: John 3:13 by which He clearly shows that the souls of the departed are not only not deprived of their reason, but that they are not even without such feelings as hope and sorrow, joy and fear, and that they already are beginning to taste beforehand something of what is reserved for them at the last judgment, and that they are not as some unbelievers hold resolved into nothing after their departure from this life: but that they live a more real life, and are still more earnest in waiting on the praises of God. And indeed to put aside for a little Scripture proofs, and to discuss, as far as our ability permits us, a little about the nature of the soul itself, is it not beyond the bounds of I will not say the folly, but the madness of all stupidity, even to have the slightest suspicion that the nobler part of man, in which as the blessed Apostle shows, the image and likeness of God consists, will, when the burden of the body with which it is oppressed in this world is laid aside, become insensible, when, as it contains in itself all the power of reason, it makes the dumb and senseless material flesh sensible, by participation with it: especially when it follows, and the order of reason itself demands that when the mind has put off the grossness of the flesh with which it is now weighed down, it will restore its intellectual powers better than ever, and receive them in a purer and finer condition than it lost them. But so far did the blessed Apostle recognize that what we say is true, that he actually wished to depart from this flesh; that by separation from it, he might be able to be joined more earnestly to the Lord; saying: I desire to be dissolved and to be with Christ, which is far better, for while we are in the body we are absent from the Lord: and therefore we are bold and have our desire always to be absent from the body, and present with the Lord. Wherefore also we strive, whether absent or present, to be pleasing to Him; and he declares indeed that the continuance of the soul which is in the flesh is distance from the Lord, and absence from Christ, and trusts with entire faith that its separation and departure from this flesh involves presence with Christ. And again still more clearly the same Apostle speaks of this state of the souls as one that is very full of life: But you have come to Mount Sion, and the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to an innumerable company of angels, and the church of the first born, who are written in heaven, and the spirits of just men made perfect. Hebrews 12:22-23 Of which spirits he speaks in another passage, Furthermore we have had instructors of our flesh, and we reverenced them: shall we not much more be subject to the Father of spirits and live?
In Christ
Theophilus
may God bless u all and pray for me too.
:)
Nice to see a fellow old timer around :) Please keep Abouna Antonious in your prayer.
In Christ
Theophilus
may God give peace and health to the patriarch of eritrea and free the church from corruption and bring healing to the people.
may God also repose the souls of the patriarchs of ethiopia and egypt and bring wisdom and purity to all our churches and help us all to pray for one another fervently with all brotherly love.
edit to add link for further info:
http://tasbeha.org/content/community/index.php/topic,12910.msg152024.html#msg152024