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Rejoice at the prospect of gay marriage.
This is what Senior Bishops in the Church of England are saying. They are also saying God grace is at work in same-sex marrige.
This is unacceptable!
What makes them think God would condone this?
People lives live for generations through the families that have gone before and it ends with the advent of one homosexual who doesn't have children. They call it love but it is also selfish and ends with the agreement of another selfish minded person. Not only that, but these people could stop another persons generation by convincing them that it is all right to be gay.
What do you think?
Comments
Sorry Ioannes, I just read it in the news paper. We know it's wrong but they still are pushing the homosexual cause. Our Bishop has spoken up against it and I'm just doing the same. I'll just say protestants and let it end there. You know Protestants were are war with themselves before there were at war with Catholics in England. The puritans against the Levelers. The conservatives against the liberals.
It is too easy to be subject to a love of the world ourselves, and yet point out others who are subject to that same love of the world in different ways as if they will be lost and we alone will be saved.
The words we read at the Liturgy yesterday teach us..
Do not love the world or the things in the world. If anyone loves the world, the love of the Father is not in him. For all that is in the world--the lust of the flesh, the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life--is not of the Father but is of the world. And the world is passing away, and the lust of it; but he who does the will of God abides forever.
This surely applies to us all. And just as there are those who make an idol of sexuality, so there are those of us who make an idol of an education, a career, even family and friends, possessions, holidays, cars etc etc.
It will be better for the one who has struggled manfully with homosexuaal temptations and has sometimes fallen yet repented, than for the outwardly devout Orthodox who seems to live a good life but is chained to this passing world with desire for material goods, wealth and the desire for advancement.
My thoughts are the same as you who have responded. Thanks for your opinions.
Just a personal thought. I've been thinking about Adam and Eve been deceived by the serpent at the tree of knowledge. No-one talks about the tree, but to me it is planted in the earth. So what I get from that is it isn't knowledge of the world that will bring us to God but God's commandments as he gave Adam and Eve a commandment and they disobeyed. A command gives direction. Therefore, truth lies in direction. In this world, it has become so easy polarize opinion by the use of good words like love, but it is really like a bribe where something good is first offered but behind it, there is something bad.
It is a terrible shame that these homo's hide behind the anonymity of the internet, seek to rile people up to justify their stance against the church. It is also a terrible shame that unrepentant homosexuals are not punished or exiled in some way. Although being barred from communion is certainly far worse than a death sentence.
I just wish Gabe and his fag friends would leave this website and go do their emo thing somewhere else.
I really do not care if homo's are able to get civil marriages or not, what I want is for them to leave the church alone. To stop pestering its adherents on forums and such. I get so tired of them jamming their insanity down our throats, coming here and trying to stir up trouble on a site with apparently no moderation whatsoever.
It is a terrible shame that these homo's hide behind the anonymity of the internet, seek to rile people up to justify their stance against the church. It is also a terrible shame that unrepentant homosexuals are not punished or exiled in some way. Although being barred from communion is certainly far worse than a death sentence.
I just wish Gabe and his fag friends would leave this website and go do their emo thing somewhere else.
We really don't need that kind of unChristian way of speech.
It is unnecessary to your cause, and detracts from your credibility - both in and outside the Church.
it was founded on the wrong principles (rebellion against rome), so it is not surprising it is half full of people / clergy who don't even believe the most basic parts of the Bible and it is now collapsing in on itself.
there are many people left in the church who still love God and try to follow him no matter what it costs, but they are now faced with the difficult decision of how much longer to stay in the church.
so please pray for people in the uk, that they will discover the riches within the orthodox church and especially pray for the british orthodox church who is reaching out to them with limited resources.
(i changed the title of the thread in my reply to emphasize the root problem)
ps copti copa, welcome! nice to see another uk person here
:)
It is not easy to find and work with those who are not Orthodox, and not even Christian, and share our faith with them.
If you are in London or the surrounding area do consider supporting our activities with your presence, it gets lonely with no support from other members of the Coptic Church.
[quote author=Ioannes link=topic=13207.msg156026#msg156026 date=1338014894]
I really do not care if homo's are able to get civil marriages or not, what I want is for them to leave the church alone. To stop pestering its adherents on forums and such. I get so tired of them jamming their insanity down our throats, coming here and trying to stir up trouble on a site with apparently no moderation whatsoever.
It is a terrible shame that these homo's hide behind the anonymity of the internet, seek to rile people up to justify their stance against the church. It is also a terrible shame that unrepentant homosexuals are not punished or exiled in some way. Although being barred from communion is certainly far worse than a death sentence.
I just wish Gabe and his fag friends would leave this website and go do their emo thing somewhere else.
We really don't need that kind of unChristian way of speech.
It is unnecessary to your cause, and detracts from your credibility - both in and outside the Church.
I do not care what kind of ad hominim you throw at me, I do not care what you think of me.
[quote author=qawe link=topic=13207.msg156033#msg156033 date=1338017034]
[quote author=Ioannes link=topic=13207.msg156026#msg156026 date=1338014894]
I really do not care if homo's are able to get civil marriages or not, what I want is for them to leave the church alone. To stop pestering its adherents on forums and such. I get so tired of them jamming their insanity down our throats, coming here and trying to stir up trouble on a site with apparently no moderation whatsoever.
It is a terrible shame that these homo's hide behind the anonymity of the internet, seek to rile people up to justify their stance against the church. It is also a terrible shame that unrepentant homosexuals are not punished or exiled in some way. Although being barred from communion is certainly far worse than a death sentence.
I just wish Gabe and his fag friends would leave this website and go do their emo thing somewhere else.
We really don't need that kind of unChristian way of speech.
It is unnecessary to your cause, and detracts from your credibility - both in and outside the Church.
I do not care what kind of ad hominim you throw at me, I do not care what you think of me.
Ioannes, forgive me, but that was a little harsh. One of HH's final wishes was that we do good to all humanity, not just coptic orthodox Christians. I really understand your frustration with him/them, but calling them names and insulting them is wrong.
[quote author=qawe link=topic=13207.msg156033#msg156033 date=1338017034]
[quote author=Ioannes link=topic=13207.msg156026#msg156026 date=1338014894]
I really do not care if homo's are able to get civil marriages or not, what I want is for them to leave the church alone. To stop pestering its adherents on forums and such. I get so tired of them jamming their insanity down our throats, coming here and trying to stir up trouble on a site with apparently no moderation whatsoever.
It is a terrible shame that these homo's hide behind the anonymity of the internet, seek to rile people up to justify their stance against the church. It is also a terrible shame that unrepentant homosexuals are not punished or exiled in some way. Although being barred from communion is certainly far worse than a death sentence.
I just wish Gabe and his fag friends would leave this website and go do their emo thing somewhere else.
We really don't need that kind of unChristian way of speech.
It is unnecessary to your cause, and detracts from your credibility - both in and outside the Church.
I do not care what kind of ad hominim you throw at me, I do not care what you think of me.
What's the point of referring to homosexuals with such invective, when their actions can just as easily be denounced calmly and rationally through logic and biblical quotations?
And btw its "ad hominem"
Don't forget, we are not arguing to prove who is right. We are discussing how to deal with those people who are tormented by this disorder. We are discussing the treatment of these children of God. He does not take the torment of His children lightly... at all.
From dealing with homosexuals, what I have learned is that they often have a problem with the church, and so, they drift away from it. In drifting away from the church, they drift away from God. So to bring them back to God for healing, we must help them love the church. Pejorative terms such as fag do the exact opposite and drive them away from the church feeling unloved, thus driving them away from God.
Driving them away from God, is a sin that even Christ admitted would have the heaviest of prices to pay. Mark 9:42
Be careful with god's beloved children. We are against homosexual acts and lust, but the people; well, they may be holier than us! Fr. Seraphim Rose? Fr. Henri Nouwen? Care to call them fags? It seems that these days, name calling from both sides has taken over reasonable understanding.
ReturnOrthodoxy
If they are true in been children of God then there treatment is an offering of repentance. If they refuse, it is not only been sorry about what they have done but also denying there is anything wrong. Their conscience has become so liberal as to say to themselves it is ok. What conscience has the government if they agree with them?
The above link is exemplary of a homosexual who loves his church for being against homosexuality, and for being loving and accepting of him. That is the key.
ReturnOrthodoxy
Forgive me as I was been protective.
We probably mean the same thing. We both want to respect the,but be strict against homosexuality. I'm sure we know what we are both talking about. There is nothing to forgive :D
ReturnOrthodoxy
I do respect them however they are pushing for rights that say there life style is normal. Governments are increasingly allowing these rights and in doing so we find that their rights supersede ours. We all want to be ourselves, however, they are not themselves because they are making an idol of their own image. I'm married to a woman and in doing so I married someone weaker, so It is my job to protect her. When I've done that she honours me back with comfort just like Jesus when he saved Mary Magdilene and she washed his feet with her hair.
ReturnOrthodoxy
ReturnOrthodoxy
LOL!
I do love everybody as they are God's, but that isn't the issue for me. What I was saying in the last post was talking firstly, protection and from that honour. It isn't the homosexuals I'm mainly worried about but the protection of others. When we honour we come to agreement and from agreement peace but it starts with protection.
Ioannes, irishpligrim and others seek help from the church because they have a problem and want God's help. First of all they need to feel protected. The homosexuals I'm talking about are not seeking help but instead seek the demise of the church for the comfort of their own conscience.
Yes big trouble if I say she is the weaker. I thought I was humble before but I have a lot more to go. Please pray for me in this. Wisdom comes from being humble. I think I will die a wise man.
You can't make them love it, but I can think you can give them less fear of it.
But there is another word we use to describe our behavior towards them in general: love. We may or may not respect some of them (we definitely do not respect their choice of homosexual actions), but we are commanded to love all of them without any other reason except the fact that they are human.