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Politics
Hello everyone how ya all doin? For a while now I've been reading posts over this board and I thought I'd contribute by starting a topic, one I'm sure might get a lot of attention. I was just having a political debate with a fellow board member, Thebrain, and we both agreed this would make a good discussion on the board. I'm hoping everyone here can open their minds to other peoples opinions, and just share their feelings and opinions. I hope you all don't mind me starting a topic like this, cause this tends to either seperate people, or bring them closer together.
I'm a Democrat, which kinda makes me the minority here. I'm sure most of you voted republican this year because of gay marriages, abortion, or just plain social and economic reasons. I'd like to hear some reasons why you wanted/did vote for Bush or Kerry, whether they may be a religious topic or just a regular topic such as economy and terrorism. Please, share anything you want.
Dave
I'm a Democrat, which kinda makes me the minority here. I'm sure most of you voted republican this year because of gay marriages, abortion, or just plain social and economic reasons. I'd like to hear some reasons why you wanted/did vote for Bush or Kerry, whether they may be a religious topic or just a regular topic such as economy and terrorism. Please, share anything you want.
Dave
Comments
Maria
but i think that bush was the best choice in this case i've read many letters sent to bush from the coptic community and God willing he will reply
hopefully he'll stop these terrorists threats ;D
sure to most people the outcome looked bad but if u think about it both choices were not the best lol the choices
but i think that bush was the best choice in this case i've read many letters sent to bush from the coptic community and God willing he will reply
hopefully he'll stop these terrorists threats ;D
Dumb and dumber...Bush who cannot say one sentence without stuttering, who got a C Avg in college, was arrested for drugs in the 70's, arrested for DUI's, and went awol from the Air National Guard is the smart one? Kerry who volunteered to serve in Vietnam, fought against war crimes, and had an A avg in college is stupid? Wow...I'm shocked. Bush knew nothing during the debates, when he was asked questions on Iraq he made the smartest move, he changed his answer to "Terrorism isnt important, but education is" and talked about education. Wow...smart man.
Bush cannot be trusted to stop these terrorists. He even admited 6 months after September 11 that "I don't know where bin laden is. I have no idea and really don't care. It's not that important. It's not our priority." You serioussly trust him to defend us when we have only 10,000 soldiers in afghanistan looking for the most wanted man, whereas we have 100,000 soldiers in Iraq? Remember, he did nothing to try and stop september 11. He was presented with the document "Bin Laden determined to attack inside the United States", and he ignored it and went on vacation. This entire thing is getting worse by invading Iraq. That place is a haven for terroristic recruitment. The reason they hate us so much is because of what we're doing there. They know that we're there for oil, and so do we. Why else would the "First Priority" of our military be to secure the oil fields? Bush couldn't less about the people of Iraq, just as long as he gets his profits he's happy.
And the letters being sent to him, he doesn't read them. You should all know that by now. He gets thousands of letters everyday, and his advisors just read the most important ones and throw the rest away. We've sent him so many letters, but haven't recieved one reply. I don't think he cares much about much about us, don't get me wrong though, I pray that he actually does read our letters, but I know he won't care. He just doesnt. He didn't care about us in 2000, he didn't care about sudan when genocide was going on, and he won't care now cause we're going into Iran.
George Bush is a strong supporter of a Federal Marriage Amendment which is the only way to stop liberal judges from imposing gay marriage on the states against the wishes of the voters and State Legislatures
Do you want to allow the United Nations to control where American troops are sent? John Kerry said he did...
When the going got tough, George Bush got going and fought tooth and nail to give tax relief to American families. He worked hard to end the marriage penalty, increased the size of the child tax credit, gave Americans their hard earned tax dollars back in the form of rebates, and saw to it that 92 million Americans got to keep an average of $1,083 more of their own money.
The anti-ballistic-missle treaty is just a waste of tax-payer money. We do not need a missle defense, no need whatsoever. We have the airforce and the navy to do the job for us. Terrorists arent going to try using planes again, it's stupid. No one tries the same thing the second time. Think about it, after their attack we stepped up security in airports, they know it, we know it. They aren't going to try the same thing again, they know they would fail. Having a missle defense system is going to do nothing but waste perfectly good money that can be used to give our soldiers the armor and protection they need to fight in iraq and afghanistan. I as well as many liberals alike do not support gay marriage. Don't think all liberals want gay marriage, only a small minority of it does. The FMA is a sad thing to see. This is the *second* time in history in which rights have been suspended by the constitution. I would have liked to see gay marriage a state issue, not a national issue. Make it a state issue, let the states vote upon it and make their own laws on it. I don't support gay marriage, but I'd like to give civil unions a choice to the gay community. Let them have the economic and the social privileges, such as the tax cut and being able to pay/visit each other in the hospitals...etc. Alright see that's a misinterpretation of his statement. If you had heard his other statements, he stated that he would work in the UN, but would never let them control the military. He said to work with, not to let them control it. The UN was made so countries could work side by side to increase prosperity and keep wars from erupting. Bush could care less about the world's opinion. Bush thinks just because we are the most powerful nation in the world, that we don't have to abide by international law. Remember King Louis XIV of France - "I am the state"? Well right now, "America is the state." Whatever we say goes, and no one can stand up to us. Hitler didn't care either and we saw what happened then. I am shocked to see that we no longer care about the world, I guess history always has to repeat itself right? May I ask where you got this information from? I know people who only got an avg of 300 dollars back from the rebates, and are saving less than 200 dollars a year on taxes. I'd like some links to this if possible.
~Dave
Coptic Dave,
Your really raising my blood pressure!...lol...just kidding....Seriously though it would be nice if you would lay off critisizing my emperor...oops I mean my president...lol...Long live George Bush!
what does any of this have to do with the Coptic Church? ??? :-\
acctually it kinda does..i had to do a report on election2004 and my topic was"whos side is God on" and it said 52% Bush and 48% Kerry..i'll try to find the artical i got the info from and i'll post it asap
We all have to understand that our political standing is our own opinion, It has no ýrelevance to our salvation. ý
Having said that, I have a methodology that I live by, figured I would share. All those ýwho stand there and advocate that they are better at leading people, are NOT. and those ýwho are better at leading people, don't advocate (its like someone said, "Those who want ýit don't deserve it and those who deserve it don't want it") Both Bush, Kerry, Clinton, any ýother politician is not whole concerned with the job as the return. Think about it, it is a ýtough job, everybody is criticizing you, you are always in the spot light and the pay is ýmediocre. So why would anybody want it? Two main reasons that I have been able to ýdeduce. ý
ý1) recognition (Leader of the strongest country in the world)ý
ý2) The "fringe" benefits
That is not to say we didn't get a few good ones (Washington, Roosevelt, etc...) but that is ýmy take.ý
When I voted for bush, I did vote for the lesser of 2 evils. You say Kerry volunteered for ýNam, only stayed for 6 months (or was it six weeks?) We voted for the morals that Bush ýsaid he stood for (key word here is SAID) We all know that Bush doesn't care about the ýIraqis having their election or their freedom. He did it thinking and hoping that this will ýdeter terrorists from attacking us here. You speak about how he doesn't care about bin ýladen, guess what, same question was posed to Clinton and we got the same answer. Had ýClinton bothered to find him (bin laden) we wouldn't be where we are today. Bush Senior ýbuilt a strong economy, Clinton (D), rode the wave and enjoyed it. He (Clinton) drained ýthe US economy. Bush Jr. is just trying to recover from what his predecessor did. ý
I guess I may seem like I am not making any sense but what I am trying to say is, Bush is ýnot the best guy but Kerry is worst. America choose the lesser of two evils. When you get ýyour hands on someone who cares about the US first before his own benefits, try to make ýhim a president and he will refuse. ý
That is my story and I am sticking to it! ;D
This alone, I think, is grounds to vote for neither.
"a good president is harder to find than a good composer of music, and not many people can compose good music"
this is a quote on my history class' board. I read it when im bored(which is everyday) and I wonder...
have we had or ever will have a good president?
i mean presidents are people and they make mistakes and dont forget the pressure dudes, i mean he has to please every kind of race nationality theology in america...thats tough. :-\
so we should just look at the good and the bad, not their personal views bc dont forget it doesnt all matter about the president, we have the checks and balances policy. so congress and the supreme court are a major part. So it realy doesnt matter what the president believes.(well not so much anyway)
so unless hes some dictator like hitler who can convice america that the gm of tyson is breeding chickens that can dance, i dont think we have a problem.
Kerry didint fight against war crimes. He lied about them to further his political career, and in the process helped the Vietnamese Communists win. That same Vietnamese Communist government now persecutes and tortures Christians. Thanks for that Mr Kerry.
The reason that there is only 10,000 troops in Afghanistan is numbers dont matter in the kind of work they are engaged in. Large numbers of troops bumbling around would not help find bin Laden.
The reason the oil fields were the first to be secured is because they are essential to Iraqs future, and would have been targeted by Saddam, in the same way that they were in Kuwait. Securing a good future for Iraq meant we had to protect Iraq's source of income. Thats oil.
We are not in Iraq for oil. The US no longer gets most of its oil from the Middle East. It comes from Russia, domestic sources, and other sources. The ME is not a major source of oil for the US.
But even if we had been interested in Iraqs oils, a war was not the best way to get it. If we had wanted to get Iraqi oil, all we had to do was say Saddam is no longer a threat, and invite him back into the arms of the international community. He would have jumped at the chance, and US oil companies could have moved in safely and peacefully. This is why, contrary to popular myth, the oil companies were opposed to the war.
The Kyoto treaty was a fraud and would have done nothing to improve air pollution. Leaving China and India out of the treaty, which was the case, meant that in 10 to 15 years the problem of air pollution would have been the same. As Bush said, the treaty was fatally flawed for that reason amongst others.
The United Nations is a corrupt and morally vile organisation that promotes abortion, and that, in its entire history has failed to prevent one war or help one group of starving people. Bush is right to treat it with skepticism.
The argument that Bush does not care about world opinion, and that he thinks that just becuase the US is the most powerful nation it can do what it wants is not backed up by the facts. For example, Bush went out of his way to get the UN and its member states onside over Iraq. If he didint care, as you claim, he wouldnt have bothered trying at all. And in fact, many countries did side with the US over Iraq. Bui leaders have to lead and make hard choices. When it was clear that some countries, mainly France, Russia and China ( all of which had been selling weapons to Iraq) were going to put there own petty issues before the liberation of the Iraqi people, then Bush had to decide. I think he made the right choice. But regardless, it is simply not true that he does not care about world opinion.
Bush is not perfect, but he has done more than any President in more than fifty years to promote Christian values and begin the task of rolling back abortion.
AMEN! The whole post was right on! People love propaganda more than truth. It's good to hear the truth presented in such a powerful and forthright manner! Job well done! ;)
Oh, one more thing about his speech deficiency (if it does exist) One of America's ýGreatest Presidents was crippled Francis D. Roosevelt. He stayed in office longer than ýanybody else and was able to pull the US out of the worst economical downfalls of all ýtime.ý
There's actually disagreement over whether FDR pulled the US out of that economic slump:
http://www.mises.org/fullstory.aspx?Id=1623
Some economists think that his federal manipulation actually slowed down a natural economic recovery, but that because those federal manipulations were so prominent, people ended up crediting them with the recovery.
Not that any of this goes against your main point, that a disability does not necessarily prevent a president from being quite powerful or effective. Roosevelt was certainly both. However, as a side-issue, some people (I included) would argue that what he did with his power and his ability to be very effective was not good.
For example, the whole issue of social security had a non-government solution that, from accounts I've read, worked quite well, and was voluntary and competitive, and had the added benefit of creating meaningful social connections between people in the community:
http://www.fee.org/vnews.php?nid=2201
However, instead of encouraging people to explore voluntary options like this, the FDR's New Deal was set on creating big government bureaucracies to solve all sorts of problems, funded forcibly by the government, and drastically increasing the power of the federal government... very much *not* in line with the founding principles of the US, in my opinion.