Abouna Anthony Messah - Faith in Action

[Deleted User]

These are SO GOOD and so meaning full; I could not let it go without sharing these amazing videos.

What I am about to share now is something that helped me A LOT hopefully it will help other people also.

There are four parts to this series made by Abouna Anthony Messeh called: Faith in Action.

Part 1: I Believe In God, But I Don't Fear Him  


Part 2: I Believe In God, But I Don't Go Overboard


Part 3: I Believe In God, But I Trust In Earthly Treasures



Part 4: I Believe In God, But I Don't Know Him


It was definitely worth 169 min and 51 seconds of my life!

He has truly has a gift of communication when speaking of his point!

EDIT: Abouna Anthony Messeh not Messah sorry!

TITL

Thanks for taking the time to post these, but I'm not a big fan of his sermons.

God bless your kindness and service.

imikhail

TTL,

I am curious as to the reason why not.

Thanks.

TITL

I do not like his method, presentation, or material. His sermons make me feel uncomfortable, and I do not benefit.

yousiegtennis

I think he makes good points in his sermons but I saw one video of a sermon in which he had a live demonstration in front of the altar (this was the sermon after the gospel in the middle of the liturgy) and he had a young man fall backwards to demonstrate faith...he said and I quote: "give him a hand."  And people clapped in church.  In front of the altar.  In the middle of the liturgy.  So, like TITL, there are certain things I don't like in his sermons.

[edit]: This is what I don't like...

Starting from about 0:40 on...

geomike

This is ridiculous. I feel like I am watching a protestant sermon. This is disrespectful to do in church. Something is really weird with churches in the US now a days. I attend one but we have the utmost respect for it. I don't know why people are treating church like a joke now a days. It is really saddening to tell you the truth.

TITL

You're starting to sound like ILSM. That can't be good.

But I definitely agree with your post.

Michael Boutros

I have very little knowledge about US geography, so where exactly is this church state-wise, and under which diocese would it be?

geomike

umm... If you r talking about abouna Anthony's church it is in Washington D.C.

yousiegtennis

geomike,
I also get the impression that his sermons sometimes border on Protestantism.  But it can't be denied...he does make some good points.

geomike

Yes, yes of course. I don't mean to insult him or anything. He isn't ordained a priest for no reason obviously. I was just saying at times i don't feel like i am watching a coptic sermon.

yousiegtennis

Totally agree with you.

imikhail

I wish sermons are mjxed with Orthodox treasures

[Deleted User]

Yeah I kind of see what you mean, but  he proves points and he really tries his best to prove them well shown by his effort. No matter what, he is a priest and he should be respected; and just like geomike said, he was ordained for a reason.

I know for one thing, he didn't say anything wrong.......right?
The vomit thing got me cracking up though. ;D

Christforlife7

RIP Kerelos Makhloof. We love and miss you so much.

Abouna Anthony is a blessing to our Orthodox Church.

Let's not forget, a sermon can not be "Protestant-ish" unless it is inline with Protestant Theology. The same goes for a "Coptic sermon". Just because he doesn't have a cane or an accent, doesn't mean it isn't Coptic. We need to get rid of this mentality, and search for what the hearts of these priests are sharing with us that they learned during their personal time with Jesus. This is a true shepherd. A different style doesn't call for him being called a Protestant.

And they are known as the Washington DC church, but they are located at Fairfax, Virginia.

yousiegtennis

Tishori,
I personally wasn't calling him out for his style of speech per se.  I was more concerned about pulling off a demonstration in the middle of the liturgy and having people clapping in the middle of it.  If this was done during a youth meeting, then I would have had absolutely no problem with it.  DURING THE LITURGY is something completely different.  I live in CA and we have priests here who are young and speak perfect English.  Each priest certainly has his "style" if you will, but doing stuff like that in the middle of the liturgy bothers me.  I don't know if he does it often but that particular sermon struck me as odd.

the_least

Whoever thinks he is protestant-ish, can you clearly state what you think is so protestant about him. Cracking jokes in the middle of the sermon? so what? what's wrong with that? he learns from the master, pope Shenouda :)

maybe what he did in the video that was posted is a bit weird for a Liturgy sermon especially the "give him a hand" part that slipped out; however, it seems like he was only using it as a tool to get his point across.

yousiegtennis

[quote author=the_least link=topic=11133.msg134920#msg134920 date=1301642588]
Whoever thinks he is protestant-ish, can you clearly state what you think is so protestant about him. Cracking jokes in the middle of the sermon? so what? what's wrong with that? he learns from the master, pope Shenouda :)

maybe what he did in the video that was posted is a bit weird for a Liturgy sermon especially the "give him a hand" part that slipped out; however, it seems like he was only using it as a tool to get his point across.


I don't think cracking jokes is the issue...I think it's the context in which he did it.

epchois_nai_nan

[quote author=Tishori link=topic=11133.msg134916#msg134916 date=1301635412]
Let's not forget, a sermon can not be "Protestant-ish" unless it is inline with Protestant Theology. The same goes for a "Coptic sermon". Just because he doesn't have a cane or an accent, doesn't mean it isn't Coptic. We need to get rid of this mentality, and search for what the hearts of these priests are sharing with us that they learned during their personal time with Jesus. This is a true shepherd. A different style doesn't call for him being called a Protestant.


I massively agree.

PFM

TITL

His sermons aren't exactly 100% Protestant theology free. I've listened to quite a few of his sermons, that unfortunately, contradicted the Orthodox faith. A few priests and bishops would agree (I'm not just saying that, I actually asked around).


Since I'm not strong in my faith, I don't think it's safe for me to listen to an "Orthodox" sermon that might have Protestant teachings, lest I, unintentionally, drift from the faith. The devil will never present us with an obvious error, but rather one that is small and insignificant (ie: listening to Protestant songs on the radio, or worse, listening to a Coptic priest that MIGHT teach Protestant theology). If we open the door once, it will be hard to close it the second time, because we have already let him in.

I hope Fr. Peter can take time from his busy schedule to listen to one of Fr. Anthony's sermons and share with us his insights. :)

imikhail

The only thing I have read so far is that the presentation style is un-Coptic but that is not the same as un-Orthodox.

I believe the discussion on this thread is inappropriate by all means. If there is something that is unorthodox said in any of Fr. Anthony's sermons, then let's discuss it. If not then I believe Fr. Peter should lock this thread.

Thanks.

[Deleted User]

I agree with you Tishori and imikhail.

I think his sermons are amazing. God bless him!

I just wanted to ask two questions: What do you think a coptic sermon contains? What do you think a "un-coptic" or "un-orthodox" sermon contains and what it is?

In simpler terms: What is the difference? Can someone explain?

TITL

A Coptic sermon is supported by sayings of the fathers, and not made up from one's own thoughts and speculations. A Coptic sermon does not contradict the Bible in any way. A Coptic sermon is one given through the Holy Spirit.

An Un-Orthodox is the opposite of everything I just said.

[Deleted User]

So then, what did he say that was unorthodox or uncoptic. Can you give an example (doesn't have to be from his sermon)?

TITL

I'd rather not. I've caused enough trouble as it is, and I don't want any further damage. You can ask your FOC what he thinks.

peterfarrington

My understanding of the Fathers is that an Orthodox sermon should not be excitable and loud. It should be serious and prayerful. It should be Scriptural and Patristic. It should not be like stand-up comedy and should not provoke raucous laughter. It should not be filled with anecdotes. It should be both theological and spiritual rather than moralistic.

The examples should be St John Chrysostom, St Severus, St Philoxenus, and the other Fathers who have left us collections of their most valuable sermons.

socoolbishoy

if we hear a boring sermon we will complain, if we hear an interactive sermon we will complain, if we hear a sermon we will complain, if we dont hear a sermon we will complain, complaining is all we do, and will never cease...

do not forget due to the grace of God, how many youth came to God because of Abouna Anthony Messeha, do not forget all this effort he did for the youth and her church. saint John Chrysostom, St Severus, St Philoxenus, were all fathers in a time where there is no tv, where there is no media, where people could sit and pay attention for days upon days... but now we have an attention span of 15 minutes on average, even the pope is aware of this, next time you hear the pope's lecture time it, it will not be more than 20 minutes, he even teaches this... and what abouna Anthony does is he takes his 10 minutes rich of God's teachings and puts it in a language for the youth, whose attention goes less and less everyday.

so should we not care about the youth who do not pay attention? should we not care for the youth who are bored with a person talking and talking with nothing interactive?


neshkor Allah akhadna el baraka!

[Deleted User]

Well said, ✞SuperMAN✞(BAM)✞!  ;D

Thanks for explaining, Father Peter, but truly it doesn't matter what kind of sermon it is, as long as it is speaking of the word of God ( correctly), it catches my attention.

Please remember me in your prayers.

peterfarrington

I do not know what any priests sermons are like. So I am not criticising anyone.

But if we will not pay attention to the word of God then what should we do? Water everything down to a 10 minute attention span and forever treat people as children, or insist that they must grow up and become mature in the faith.

To say that youth have an attention span of 10 minutes is an excuse. It may be a fact, but it we can only attend to God for 10 minutes then we sin. We must not encourage the youth to sin by failing to attend to God as is due to Him.

Youth will watch many things for a long time. They will watch a football match, they will watch a film, they will watch a concert. If they will not listen to the word of God for 20-30 minutes then they must be taught that they are at fault, not pandered to. How are people helped to grow if they are not challenged for their lack of faith? How is it teaching the Faith if everything difficult is removed?

Will we develop a 2 minute Agpeya, a 10 minute sermon, a 20 minute liturgy just to pander to people who do not yet wish to give God all that they are? Or do we set an example before them of lives lived entirely for God? If you think that the Sermons of St John Chrysostom or St Severus were not entirely absorbing then you have not read enough or in decent translations. The sermons of St John Chrysostom and St Severus would be beautiful and transforming in any age.

If the youth really can only concentrate on God for 10 minutes then somethine seriously urgent needs to be done to help them grow up and become mature, or they will never have the spiritual resources to grow as Christians or even as adult human beings. It is surely a shameful thing to have to say that an Orthodox sermon cannot be longer than 10 minutes? If the youth are bored then they need to confess their sin. To be bored at the preaching of the word of God is a dreadful sin.

dzheremi

I don't think the problem is if people laugh or enjoy themselves, I think the problem might be if people remember the sermon because it made them laugh and enjoyed, rather than made them seriously reflect on the scriptures and the traditions of the church. Is that what you mean, Fr. Peter? I think it is better for a sermon to be serious, but if people are drawn to the priest's style of presentation and that helps them to remember, then there's no problem. The point is that God's word comes first, and should be the most important thing in your life -- not your own entertainment and happy feelings.

[Deleted User]

Lol.....Father Peter, his sermons were from 40 to 60 minutes long each and there were four of them. But I like your point of view that sometimes we go to concerts or watch football without getting bored, but when it comes to God time, sometimes we pass.

That's why I think that most sermons today are trying to catch the youth's attention by giving real examples based on what is in the bible...making it easier to relate to and at the same time using the resources.

Whatever will speak about the word of God(correctly), though, is important whether its a book, a sermon, or a hymn. So picking up a book about God and not finding it interesting because it does not make sense to you, will not help.

But if you pick up a spiritual book that you could relate to and is all about the bible, it will come into your interest. I think its the same with sermons, although any sermon can be related to. And that's how I feel with Pope Shenouda's books.

You're right dzheremi....I really like your point of view also!
Please pray for me.....