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Why is it wrong..???
Why is it wrong to chew gum in church? Or even better....why is it disrespectful to chew gum. For example I was chewing gum in the church building but not in the church ITSELF. I didn't think onwas wrong until an older servant told me that I should not be chewing gum at all in church.....it didn't bother me to ask why but now it does. WHY OH WHY IS IT WRONG TO CHEW GUM?!?
Comments
In your house, if someone curses in your living room, isn't it the same as cursing in your bathroom or kitchen? You don't chew gum in front of a King, neither do you do it in the King's palace.
Someone explained it to me like this:
In your house, if someone curses in your living room, isn't it the same as cursing in your bathroom or kitchen? You don't chew gum in front of a King, neither do you do it in the King's palace.
This implies that it is wrong to chew gum anywhere. To be honest, I don't really see anything wrong with it, especially considering all of the other things (eating and other nonsense) that go on in the church building.
Inside the church, no eating should be allowed (even out of Liturgy times), or chewing gums, or any other act that can show a very small amount of disrespect. The Church teaches us that Her womb (where we go in) is holier than the holies of holies in the Old Testament. Smiling, playing with mobiles, answering phone calls, chewing gums, etc, are prohibited.
Oujai qen `P[C
Dear deaconmark123 and George_Mina_Awad,
Inside the church, no eating should be allowed (even out of Liturgy times), or chewing gums, or any other act that can show a very small amount of disrespect. The Church teaches us that Her womb (where we go in) is holier than the holies of holies in the Old Testament. Smiling, playing with mobiles, answering phone calls, chewing gums, etc, are prohibited.
Oujai qen `P[C
then how about gatherings that the church holds?..which always include food. and people socializing? and the agapy meal after church service? and summer camps?
[quote author=ophadece link=topic=12000.msg142656#msg142656 date=1312650345]
Dear deaconmark123 and George_Mina_Awad,
Inside the church, no eating should be allowed (even out of Liturgy times), or chewing gums, or any other act that can show a very small amount of disrespect. The Church teaches us that Her womb (where we go in) is holier than the holies of holies in the Old Testament. Smiling, playing with mobiles, answering phone calls, chewing gums, etc, are prohibited.
Oujai qen `P[C
then how about gatherings that the church holds?..which always include food. and people socializing? and the agapy meal after church service? and summer camps?
Ophadece seems to be referring to behavior inside the church (correct me if I'm wrong?) I'm talking about outside of the church itself, i.e, the church basement (since that's what the OP seems to be referring to also).
i remember my dad (uk) telling us not to chew gum in the street as it looked rude to walk along chewing and opening the mouth with gum in it, pulling out strings of gum etc. etc. after a few years he gave up as everyone was doing it and at least we weren't drinking beer on the street! it was a purely cultural thing that it was rude in that generation. in the end we agreed we could do it if he wasn't around and if there weren't other older folks around who didn't like it.
but in church, if you have taken Holy Communion, you should not chew gum, at least for several hours, as you could throw away the bit of gum from out of your mouth with a bit of the Body of Christ on it (consecrated bread).
as a general rule, we should try to obey those rules we don't understand as respecting our seniors is good for our spiritual life.
if we don't agree with the rule, we should obey it, and then discuss it with the person who made the rule at a convenient time, and with the intention of trying to understand it.
Oujai qen `P[C
Dear deaconmark123 and George_Mina_Awad,
Inside the church, no eating should be allowed (even out of Liturgy times), or chewing gums, or any other act that can show a very small amount of disrespect. The Church teaches us that Her womb (where we go in) is holier than the holies of holies in the Old Testament. Smiling, playing with mobiles, answering phone calls, chewing gums, etc, are prohibited.
Oujai qen `P[C
smiling?!
If you read any euchologion's preface, you will notice that instructions to deacons state that they should not even greet each other. Greetings should only be offered to God and the saints, and in very exceptional circumstances just nod to the other deacon present. Of course we are talking about strict practices, but these are traditions of our church. How much do we fall short on them? How much by percent? How much in principle?
Oujai qen `P[C
Dear Midiane,
If you read any euchologion's preface, you will notice that instructions to deacons state that they should not even greet each other. Greetings should only be offered to God and the saints, and in very exceptional circumstances just nod to the other deacon present. Of course we are talking about strict practices, but these are traditions of our church. How much do we fall short on them? How much by percent? How much in principle?
Oujai qen `P[C
I've never read that. Can you provide a reference? Thanks.
Oujai
When entering inside such a sacred place, one's entire behaviour, or gestures have to be measured. You cannot run, nor speak too loud.
Indeed, it is a bit of a shame that after the liturgy is over in major feast days that we tend to forget where we are - and the Church itself becomes more of a scene from a café.
in fact people don't believe me when i say i get grumpy sometimes at work, they think i smile all the time!
(that's why i took the name 'mabsoota'). yes i do feel sad about my sins and i take time to repent and pray during the liturgy, but after taking Holy Communion i can't be sad, i just feel so so grateful to know such a great and loving God and so content that i found such a beautiful spiritual home.
8)
:)
:D
;D
Oujai
Of course that's ok mabsoota if you are smiling as a result of attaining the most holy Grace, but not looking at others and smiling, or greeting somebody with a smile etc. I actually need to discipline myself now that everyone is encouraging me to benefit from this thread, and stop smiling to deacons when the lead trips in a hazza, or constantly ask somewhat loudly what's the next hymn, etc...
Oujai
(emphasis mine)
What is this?! What do you have against smiling in the church? Should we also avoid eye contact when greeting a person. Maybe we shouldn't even turn around - you know we could just all stick our hands backward and give "low-fives." Even better we should all close our eyes throughout the liturgy. I'll actually do you one better - let's create several individual cubicles so you can't see the people around you.
ophadece, what you are suggesting is plain silly. It is one thing to smile because you are laughing at something but there is nothing wrong with smiling for joy at seeing a fellow brother or sister.
This is exactly why people think Orthodoxy entails always having a frown and looking down at the floor your whole life.
I hope I am misunderstanding you. If not, I disagree with you completely. I encourage people to smile and smile frequently. Smile at every person you see. Smile until your jaw hurts. Who can be in the presence of God and not smile?!
Oujai
Oujai
Pray for my weakness and forgive my caps in all different places lol
+sister in Christ
...for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life. 2 Corinthians 3:6
+ Irini nem ehmot,
...for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life. 2 Corinthians 3:6
LOVEEEEE THATTTT VERSEEEE!!!!
Instructions for the deacon as per the euchologion book of "nahdet el kanayes":
(3) should imagine at his arrival to the church that he is entering heaven to stand in front of the Most High between the angels and the saints.
(7) not to greet any one during practising the religious rites and if necessary it would suffice to put his hand on his chest bowing his head.
(8) not to speak with anyone at all and not to whisper in his ears or gesture with any sign of commending signs or displeasure, neither by words or by gesture, as he is in the presence of God.
(9) not to sit down during the Liturgy and not to get out before its ending.
(10) to participate with the priest in praying only with his senses.
Of course the arguments you provided are all valid, and our God is not quick to punish (and it is not a punishment provoking act to smile in the church anyway), but God would be much happier if He sees us treating His holy place as one would in a military office, or with the president, or with the king. How much more is Our King worthy of more and more honour and discipline?
Oujai qen `P[C
Sorry for being that late in replying. Busy last couple of days...
Instructions for the deacon as per the euchologion book of "nahdet el kanayes":
(3) should imagine at his arrival to the church that he is entering heaven to stand in front of the Most High between the angels and the saints.
(7) not to greet any one during practising the religious rites and if necessary it would suffice to put his hand on his chest bowing his head.
(8) not to speak with anyone at all and not to whisper in his ears or gesture with any sign of commending signs or displeasure, neither by words or by gesture, as he is in the presence of God.
(9) not to sit down during the Liturgy and not to get out before its ending.
(10) to participate with the priest in praying only with his senses.
Of course the arguments you provided are all valid, and our God is not quick to punish (and it is not a punishment provoking act to smile in the church anyway), but God would be much happier if He sees us treating His holy place as one would in a military office, or with the president, or with the king. How much more is Our King worthy of more and more honour and discipline?
Oujai qen `P[C
So I take it you just inserted the bit about smiling because you felt like it? We call God our Father, not our military officer.
[quote author=Unworthy1 link=topic=12000.msg143908#msg143908 date=1314751800]
[quote author=ophadece link=topic=12000.msg143902#msg143902 date=1314734300]
Sorry for being that late in replying. Busy last couple of days...
Instructions for the deacon as per the euchologion book of "nahdet el kanayes":
(3) should imagine at his arrival to the church that he is entering heaven to stand in front of the Most High between the angels and the saints.
(7) not to greet any one during practising the religious rites and if necessary it would suffice to put his hand on his chest bowing his head.
(8) not to speak with anyone at all and not to whisper in his ears or gesture with any sign of commending signs or displeasure, neither by words or by gesture, as he is in the presence of God.
(9) not to sit down during the Liturgy and not to get out before its ending.
(10) to participate with the priest in praying only with his senses.
Of course the arguments you provided are all valid, and our God is not quick to punish (and it is not a punishment provoking act to smile in the church anyway), but God would be much happier if He sees us treating His holy place as one would in a military office, or with the president, or with the king. How much more is Our King worthy of more and more honour and discipline?
Oujai qen `P[C
So I take it you just inserted the bit about smiling because you felt like it? We call God our Father, not our military officer.
So it wasn't just me then. I thought I may have needed to get my eyes checked or something, seeing as how there is no mention at all about 'smiling' or 'smile' or any variation of the concept of smiling. Maybe you and I both lack that 'special gift' of seeing things (and/or reading into things) that just aren't there.
Oujai
Ok guys, what I've been talking about all along, and sorry if I was vague is smiling to somebody else, as a gesture of greeting them. I never spoke of smiling per se as I agreed with mabsoota when she said we inevitably smile out of happiness after partaking of the Holy Sacraments. Sorry for being vague, and hope it's clear now...
Oujai
I'm a little conflicted on this "rule" about not making any gestures whatsoever to another person. I mean we must never lose our focus during the Eucharist, but is greeting our brother whom we haven't seen in years and who finally comes to church and stands next to us losing focus? Is greeting a brother or sister with a smile if they stand next to you not showing God respect? I don't think so. If no one made any eye contact or smiled at anyone during the Eucharist it would seem like we were missing the point. Now the point isn't to socialize but the point is to be united in Christ. We are united by the Holy Mysteries to be sure but that doesn't mean we should thereby forget the manifestation of that mysterious union. And that manifestation is loving one another. I mean it would seem to me a way of glorifying God that we smile as a person takes a seat next to us.
I think emphasis on rules like this focus on some purely spiritual element of worship. It makes it seem as if praying the Divine Liturgy with less people is better and if you could get a whole pew to yourself - awesome. . .If you could get a liturgy with just you and one priest - ideal!
I don't know . . . maybe I'm wrong but I feel somewhat uncomfortable with that rule.